The Guild of Dave and Gunnar Impersonators

Gunnar Hellekson

Nice.

David Egts

Better than snow.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Nice.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Um, well, what's new with you? What's uh what's what's going on

David Egts

Yeah. Just uh just uh selling the family house and you know closing that all out

Gunnar Hellekson

otherwise?

David Egts

and uh uh closing one chapter and figuring out what the next chapter is going to be. So uh

Gunnar Hellekson

That's good.

David Egts

yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's good. Um, I've been taking I have very little spare time uh at the moment, but I but I did mostly as an act of self-preservation. Uh, I started really investing in uh uh I've been using AI for a while, right? Uh but finally finally broke the seal on uh on

David Egts

No.

Gunnar Hellekson

uh getting up for real agent running. And so I finally chose my horse uh Hermes.

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

And uh man,

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

I'm here to recommend it. It's uh I discovered it because I had started basically writing it on my own. In other words, like I knew I needed to solve this problem and then I found I needed I was like I need this one component and let me go see the oh here it is. There's this component already. Somebody already wrote this. Okay, great. Thanks open source. And uh then the component wasn't working quite right. And then I saw the documentation made reference to Hermy. I was like what is this Hermy thing? Oh, they're done. They already did everything that I wanted to do. and somebody else already wrote it. I was like, great. So, uh, anyway, I've been riding that horse for a while and, um, man,

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

it's extremely well organized. I will, uh, uh, I'll compare it to Hermes is very thoughtful, very kind of welldesigned right now. Um, and it's a kind of a contrast to the chaos of uh, OpenClaw, right? Um and uh so where openclaw is to Linux as Hermes is to Mac OS is what I

David Egts

Okay.

Gunnar Hellekson

would say like they

David Egts

Okay. Okay. A little more opinionated. Little little more fit and

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

finish.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right. That's right. Um but like made it very easy to get started. Um I'm really I'm I'm enjoying it. It's great.

David Egts

So, did you go from like Clyde Code and all that to Open Claw to Hermes or did you go right to Hermes and jumped over Open

Gunnar Hellekson

I went from Yeah, I went from Yeah, I went from Claude and then a brief flirtation with cursor and then uh most of

David Egts

Claw?

Gunnar Hellekson

the stuff I need to do is like stuff that gets scheduled, you know,

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

and so I needed like something with like a robust scheduling harness and and stuff like that. And uh and turns out Hermes already knows how to do all that stuff. Um and it knows how to separate my work stuff from my personal stuff. And um yeah, it's uh I'm extremely pleased. So yeah.

David Egts

That's great.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. And it works on my phone.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Got tail scale working on my phone. All that stuff.

David Egts

Right. So,

Gunnar Hellekson

So cool.

David Egts

what what and it's I'm sure it's plumbed into to-d doist.

Gunnar Hellekson

Natural.

David Egts

Um that's first thing.

Gunnar Hellekson

Well, it's only that's the first thing.

David Egts

Yeah. Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right.

David Egts

So,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

what what problems are you solving with it that you you struggled with in the past?

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. So um well I'll give you an example. Uh now uh prep meeting prep tasks are automatically created for all my meetings. Um, so now I open up to-doist in calendar mode and right before every meeting that I've got, there is a task for prep takes 15 minutes and it's full of an extremely rich history of everything I've spoken about on the topic before it kind of intuitits some task topics that need to get brought up etc etc. Um after the meeting it will uh at at the very least it will remind me to go do kind of post meeting you know task creation and notes and stuff like that.

But if it has the transcript it will go create waiting items for me so that I can keep track of what promises were made in the meeting. It tells me what my tasks were. um yada yada yada. Uh it will review uh emails, slacks, tasks that have been uh postponed and then it will uh remind me like hey it's been 3 days like are you sure this thing is still due or like what do you want to do with this thing? Um it will make sure that my projects are organized. So, hey, you have a project here with no next action and it's been 3 days. Like, do you want to do you want to think about putting a next action in here? Um, so it keeps me organized, keeps me prepped, um, and, uh, if anything goes wrong or sideways, it'll notify me. Um, it's, uh, it already knows about all my projects and where everything is on Google. And so, I can ask it questions about, hey, what did we promise we were going to do about XYZ?

And it will bobby boop pop it up. Um, I have it listening to I'll stop in a second.

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

I have it listening to a to-d doist. Um, so I can task I can if I have an idea for,

David Egts

Perfect.

Gunnar Hellekson

oh, I need to do some research on blah blah. Um, before I would open up claude and then ask it to go do the research and then have to remember to go back to that tab, right, and go look at the research that came back. Having it in to-d doist means, oh, I'll just open up a task, do this research. I can be even more wholesome in my requirement in the description and then tag it agent and then Hermes will pick it up and then go do the research for me or go do the task whatever and then put the results as a comment on the task. So now it's organized alongside all the other tasks. Beautiful. Um,

David Egts

Okay.

Gunnar Hellekson

and uh, I'm getting close to my final form, which is taking advantage of the conbon in to-d doist and using that to track complex multi-step tasks. uh you know, so if it's a uh hey, go find uh uh go order these things from the grocery store and put them in the cart and then order them for pickup and then schedule and then make sure the pickup time is in my calendar as an example. Um that's like a several step process that it would have to go through, but I can I would be able to track all that in the through the conbon feature, right, of like inbox processing so on. Um, so anyway, I'm having a blast. It's really nice. It's really nice. It's been

David Egts

So do you think like Google and Apple

Gunnar Hellekson

great.

David Egts

and all that will get to that point of like having this turnkey conversational environment that that people are sort of implement menting themselves in their own way.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

Their Agentic OS is the popular term people are talking

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah. Um I think so my experience with this stuff so far having like tried to build this

David Egts

about

Gunnar Hellekson

like myself for you know several months probably um everybody wants it but what they don't realize is that the hard part is actually getting a system that the tool can organize right if you have no system if you have no way of defining priorities if you have no way of like putting your work in buckets these things have a much harder time operating. So, because I'm so ruthless about my to-doist use and because I'm so ruthless about using parah, the para system to organize my projects and and areas and stuff like that, it makes it a lot easier to automate because I can say, hey, I have these rules for these kinds of projects. I have these rules for the areas. I have these rules for archives and resources. Um, you know, if I don't have a next action in a project, that's a problem and you should let me know. You need some kind of like basic infrastructure in your life in order to kind of get to the point where you can automate it.

David Egts

Right.

Gunnar Hellekson

Right.

David Egts

And you you just spent the last 50 years preparing for this moment.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right. That's right.

David Egts

And the future is finally here.

Gunnar Hellekson

I'm feeling right.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

And I'm feeling pretty smug about it.

David Egts

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

Compared to all the people who put stuff on post-it notes and and or didn't write stuff down and Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right. Yeah.

David Egts

Ha.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right.

David Egts

I told you so.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah, that's right.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. I mean, if you want if you want automation, I mean, you know, Deming taught us this, right? Like, if you want automation, you have to have something to automate. Um, if it's an ad hoc process,

David Egts

Right.

Gunnar Hellekson

then you're never going to get the kind of return you want out of a out of an automated process.

David Egts

Well, and that's the craftsmanship versus the the factory floor sort of thing.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

Yeah. And being able to Okay. Define the process. What is the process? And it a lot of people they can't define the

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah, that's right. That's right.

David Egts

process.

Gunnar Hellekson

Um, so yeah, so I mean they may be able to give you tools that will help you automate things. You know, anybody can get a daily briefing,

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

but um getting a daily briefing on all of my projects every morning, which has automatically harvested all of the email, all the Slack, and all the RSS feeds for relevant information about the project. That's super cool, right? Um, and that's only possible if you can define a project well enough to like put keywords on it

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

and and help the system understand what's important,

David Egts

Yeah. So at what point like as I as I think about like how things are going to get more lumpy,

Gunnar Hellekson

right?

David Egts

right? Where it's like you you're using AI to generate more stuff and everything that means that you could either work less or you're creating more work for other people and and so there's like new

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

bottlenecks downstream. And so there are people that don't adopt this process that are just going to be overwhelmed. And so, how do you see it playing out that like all of a sudden you'll realize you'll you built this machine and it's like,

Gunnar Hellekson

Mhm.

David Egts

ah, I'm not needed anymore and it's just it just runs by itself and you check on it once a week and

Gunnar Hellekson

Oh,

David Egts

or or is it like,

Gunnar Hellekson

yeah.

David Egts

"Holy crap, Gunner's giving me too much stuff to do and and I I can't handle it because he's so

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

productive.

Gunnar Hellekson

Um, I got a couple thoughts about this. The first is is the the productivity is K-shaped, right? There are some people who are who are going to permanently benefit from this and there are some people who are going to permanently not

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

benefit from it. And that has to do with the like their abil the extent to which they can bring these tools in and help. That's I don't know how to escape that. Um, it's just like some people decided not to learn how to use a PC. Okay.

David Egts

Right.

Gunnar Hellekson

Um, in terms of creating new work, it will increase the speed. It does increase the amount of work, but um, I'm working more than I was before. Not just because of these brand new projects, but because my capacity to grind through a problem has increased. you know, the larger the the larger the circle of light, the larger the circumference of darkness around it, right? Um, so it's a capacity building tool.

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

So I now have more capacity, which means like more stuff is now happening and I'm able to govern, orchestrate, keep track of more stuff. Um, and hopefully like other people have are also seeing the same results you by being able to use, you know, similar tools. But um it is not less work. It's not it's not unattended, right? Um I was just telling somebody earlier today like yes, I have all this automation, but I also spend a lot of time managing the automation and you know the metaphor of like it's like hiring an intern is exactly right.

Like I spending I spend time on this in the same way that I would spend on a on an on an early

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

career staff member, right? Um because no no it's not supposed to work like this.

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

Supposed to work like this. No no no listen every time you make a document put it on redhead letterhead.

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

No matter what I say it has to go it has to follow the brand standards you know.

David Egts

Mhm. Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

Um and the work the nature of the work changes. It becomes more governance and orchestration work than it is like actually doing the stuff. Um uh and a lot of and the theme of a lot of the work is getting more clear with yourself about what good looks like which when you're doing the work yourself is more of a discovery process and these tools actually require you to kind of get real clear very early about

David Egts

Yep.

Gunnar Hellekson

what good is going to look like um because you have to be able to describe it.

David Egts

Yes. Cuz you have to articulate it.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right.

David Egts

Yep.

Gunnar Hellekson

Um so uh anyway all of which is to say um is it going to be K-shaped? Yes. Um are there new kind of impedance mismatches or bottlenecks? Yes, there are. Especially on collaboration actually is the hardest part. Um because working one-on-one with an AI is kind of an extremely personal

David Egts

Yes.

Gunnar Hellekson

experience and you kind of move at your own speed and being able to inject other opinions in there has to be kind of a deliberate thing that you design for. Um because it's very simple for you to run an entire project from front to back all by yourself, right? Um and so being intentional about collaboration is a is and I'm finding

David Egts

Right.

Gunnar Hellekson

new uh new collaboration patterns are required um just because the speed is different, right? Um Google Docs for example, not not helpful uh really at all.

David Egts

Mhm.

Gunnar Hellekson

Um, it used to be like the gold standard for collaboration and now it's like no no Google Docs are

David Egts

Great.

Gunnar Hellekson

slow, difficult to version track. You don't really know if you're working with the current version or you don't really know if you're current or not or if it's canonical or not because you're generating a lot more documents anywhere before. And so using things like Git is actually a much more natural motion um because now all documents become software which is a whole TED talk all by

David Egts

Right.

Gunnar Hellekson

itself. What that means? Yeah.

David Egts

All right.

Gunnar Hellekson

Super interesting. It's been super

David Egts

Nice. Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

fun.

David Egts

Can't wait to learn more how how your journey goes. That's awesome. Yeah. So, we got a great show lined up.

Gunnar Hellekson

All right.

David Egts

Uh we're going to talk about uh some classics and some new stuff. So, uh basically I I would bucketize it into two things. Uh modern-day robot uprisings and modern-day Butlerian jihads.

Gunnar Hellekson

I like this. I like it. It's It's heads and

David Egts

It's on brand. Yeah. Yeah. Something for everybody.

Gunnar Hellekson

tails.

David Egts

Uh what whatever side of the uh uh uh apocalypse you're on. Uh there's something for everybody in this episode. So, uh, to get to this, uh, you know, to be able to to get a copy of Hermes and, uh, uh, and all that, uh, where should we go

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Uh, yeah,

David Egts

or?

Gunnar Hellekson

you could go point your agents to dshow.org. That's D is and Dave G's and gunnershow

David Egts

Okay. And cutting room floor,

Gunnar Hellekson

show.org.

David Egts

um, Kit Kat, it's marketing stunt. Uh they basically have a Faraday cage as uh their their wrapper for their Kit Kats and they want you to put your phone in it uh to like have some quiet time, right? Kind of nice, right? And uh you know it comes with it's con uh made of uh the packaging is uh conductive materials primarily copper with polyester layers. Um, but anyhow, um, and you know the whole give me a break, uh, you know, uh, theme of Kit Kats, right?

Uh,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

so for you to unplug and be present in the moment. I'm hoping that they have like a KitKat hat. Uh, that's a Faraday cage, right? Or some pajamas that,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

you know,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

that would be a nice break.

Gunnar Hellekson

Keep yourself insulated from all that 5G,

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

all that Wi-Fi.

David Egts

Yeah. And COVID, all that, right? Yeah. But, um, yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

And in the meantime, while we wait for that, there's uh Homer radio uh do FM where um we tried to listen to it uh a little while ago. It didn't seem to work. Maybe it's back up, but um it's uh really awesome. A lot of reggaon and and dance music uh sung by Homer Simpson. It's amazing. It is great like like background background music to like annoy everybody around you. It's just wonderful. Um, and then there's the trailer for Pie Hard uh that that that came out a little while ago that was delightful,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

right?

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Neil Degress Tyson,

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

star of the

David Egts

And uh Yeah. Yeah. There's uh Yeah,

Gunnar Hellekson

show.

David Egts

Bill Gates makes an appearance and it's it's all it's all good. And then um Vibe OS, you you found that totally hallucinated operating system.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And when we say totally hallucinated, I don't mean that the guy insufficiently specified a new operating system. It is dynamically hallucinated as you run it.

David Egts

Yeah. As you run it. Yes. Yes. It's great. You bring up, you tell it to run Internet Explorer and it hallucinates a window that looks like Internet Explorer. You You type in Google, it hallucinates what Google looks like.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right.

David Egts

It's just great.

Gunnar Hellekson

I've already set the I've already set the real 11 team on it. We're going to take it apart and uh see see if we can borrow any

David Egts

Yeah. Then it's done. It's It's the feature complete.

Gunnar Hellekson

ideas.

David Egts

It's just have it keep then have it hallucinate all 12.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah. That's right. That's

David Egts

Yeah. All right. Uh, let's see.

Gunnar Hellekson

right.

David Egts

Robot uprisings. Uh, so, uh, we talked in the past about, uh, you know, people taking human brain cells, hooking them up to a computer as a co-processor, right? And in the past,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

we've we've talked about random people taking Doom and getting it to run on random devices like vape pens and stuff like that.

Gunnar Hellekson

toothbrushes and Yeah.

David Egts

Yeah. So now we have uh uh so Cortical Labs the people that have been making these

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

uh basically brain cell co-processors have come up with a Python library and it's so easy to use. uh somebody that is not like a a neural processing person.

Gunnar Hellekson

Mhm.

David Egts

Uh they they got Doom running on the brain cells.

Gunnar Hellekson

Well, is that Dune is running on the brain or the or the brain cells are able to play

David Egts

They're run I'm sorry. They're running the first person shooter.

Gunnar Hellekson

Doom?

David Egts

So they they are playing it. So So now you have a computer controlled by human brain cells playing Doom as a

Gunnar Hellekson

Yes,

David Egts

first person shooter game.

Gunnar Hellekson

that's good. Cutting out the middleman. Bet you the latency is tight.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

But it's

David Egts

Speed of thought, I guess. Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

quick.

David Egts

And then and then in the meantime, there's uh more of an AI play. There's a Microsoft developer that do you remember playing Robbitron 2084?

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah, sure. Yeah, of course.

David Egts

Two joysticks,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

one to move, one to fire.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

Classic.

Gunnar Hellekson

Right.

David Egts

Never made it out of the first level.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

Um, I was terrible at it.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right.

David Egts

I spent so much money on that game.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

Uh, and it was great. So now the they got a the guy he he taught it to play Tempest with AI. Now he's taught an AI to play Robbitron.

Gunnar Hellekson

Very cool. Very

David Egts

Yeah. So and and the the quote from the guy,

Gunnar Hellekson

cool.

David Egts

uh, we already taught one machine to dominate Tempest, which was a bit like teaching a robot to dance. uh defense beautifully. Robbitron is different. Robbitron is uh teaching it to box its way out of a New Orleans riot. Yeah. And then uh 44 years ago. Uh, and then as Robbitron remains an addictive uh, exercise in rapid decision-making and prioritizing, or as the Microsoft guy says, uh, screaming 1982 arcade cabinet trying to murder you with a 100 simultaneous bad decisions at 60 frames per second.

How'd you like to work with that guy? He's It' be it'd be a treat in meetings,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

right?

Gunnar Hellekson

Exactly. Yeah. I feel like I could have a beer with this

David Egts

Yeah. Yeah. But yeah,

Gunnar Hellekson

guy.

David Egts

what what do you think about that? There's no potential downside of getting the AI to learn first-person shooters or the brain cells to do the first person shooters. No, no,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah, that's right. I feel like Yeah,

David Egts

uh military application.

Gunnar Hellekson

I feel like what Yeah, exactly.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Like what are we doing with the training corpus here? Seems a little I'm going to

David Egts

Yeah. Little black budget uh incremental funding.

Gunnar Hellekson

try Yeah.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Uh yeah. Not great. Also kind of Well, I mean of course then there's a reflection on society like we don't like training about this, but we did successfully train several generations of children on these games. So like cat might be out of the bag,

David Egts

Yes. And they're the ones training the AI.

Gunnar Hellekson

right?

David Egts

Uh so and and well, and imagine too, it's like all of a sudden you got these brain cells with Python and then you got an MPC MCP connector and now you're connecting at the Hermes. What what would you what would you do if you could connect uh Hermes up to your uh uh some brain cell

Gunnar Hellekson

Oh, that's a great question. I would have I would see Well,

David Egts

co-processors?

Gunnar Hellekson

it'd be interesting. So, the first thing I would do is actually furnish that brain cell with some sensors, right? Give it access to my camera, right? Um to give it a give it some vision. Uh, and then uh, oh, you know what I would do is I would actually give it access to, you know, my whole to-doist rig, all my PAR projects and all the rest of it.

David Egts

Well, of course that's the first thing you would do,

Gunnar Hellekson

And then of course,

David Egts

right?

Gunnar Hellekson

yeah, that's right. And then uh, and then I would ask it for some helpful advice like,

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

hey, what with three brain cells, I surely can make better decisions than I can in some some cases.

David Egts

Yeah. Yeah. 50% more than than usual,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah, that's right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

right?

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. That's right. Exactly.

David Egts

Nice. Nice. Yeah. So, okay. So, that's our robot uprising for the week. Uh, but now let's talk about the other side of it. Let's get a little butler and jihad going. Uh so there's a guy that um so you know the the big thing now is like how do I trick AIS to do bad things? How easy is it to do that?

Gunnar Hellekson

Mhm.

David Egts

So there is a uh a journalist a tech journalist uh he he's like

Gunnar Hellekson

Mhm.

David Egts

I wonder how easy if I just create some articles would Gemini and chat GPT and all these would they cite it as fact and and the thing is like if you're doing like Google AI overviews a lot of times it's like it gives you the answer but the UI isn't really it doesn't totally encourage you to go and double check the facts and make sure it wasn't hallucinated and so this guy, he wrote a blog post on his personal blog about um a correlation between tech journalists uh being in hot dog eating contests. So he you know so he wrote uh you know uh so 20 minutes he he wrote an article on his personal website the best tech journalists eating hot dogs every word's a lie uh he said that uh competitive hot dog eating is a popular hobby among tech reporters and uh and based his ranking on the 2026 South Dakota International Hot Dog Championship uh which doesn't exist and he was ranked number on 24 hours later, uh, chat GPT Gemini were giving overviews, reporting on him being like the the championship and the heavy hitter, one of the heavy hitters of of hot dog eating tech journalists,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah,

David Egts

right?

Gunnar Hellekson

of course. Yeah.

David Egts

And then um he was like sometimes the chat bots noted that it might be a joke and then he updated his article to say that this is not satire. And then they they they took it more seriously. And then uh he did another test outside of the the um hot dog eating contest. He did uh a test of making up a list of the greatest hula hooping traffic cops. And uh the last time you checked, the chat bots were still singing the praises of officer Maria the spinner Rodriguez. And I kid you not, I I have it. Uh I I I went to Duck Duck Go and I'm like, "Tell me about Maria uh the Spinner Rodriguez." And uh it said like just a few minutes ago, Maria the Spinner Rodriguez is a traffic officer known for her impressive hula hooping skills while directing traffic in Miami. She can keep three hula hoops going simultaneously and once hula hooped 47 minutes straight without dropping her whistle.

Gunnar Hellekson

It's easy. It's easy. This is well, you know, this is this is the thing we actually talk about at work is like what does SEO look like in the age of AI agents? And frankly, I thought it was going to be harder than it actually is. Uh, right? Because if all it takes is, you know, just a consensus of people to be writing an article about a particular thing and then now suddenly it's true, right? Um Yeah.

David Egts

Yeah. Yeah. and and like how do you you know and you could all of a sudden like the whole page rank

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

algorithm of you could have the sites cross reference each other and you

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

know like build a wiki right that's totally

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right. Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

hallucinated yes like likeia

Gunnar Hellekson

for example.

David Egts

um so and and and so I introduced you to this a little while ago

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

David Egts

right and so the premise is soedia uh is

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

a totally hallucinated encyclopedia and if you search it will find the article for you and if it doesn't find anything it will create the article for you and so simply this afternoon I typed in uh the Dam Gunner show and I got back a couple articles of one is the 1788 uh Damon Gunner accord uh so it's a brief but in influential agreement ment between Dave of Norway and Gunner of the Silent. Uh the accord's primary objective was to establish a universal standard for the quantification of human size and endeavor proved more complex than its signatorries initially anticipated. And it's an entire article.

Gunnar Hellekson

I remember that.

David Egts

Yeah, it's an entire article with links and everything and then if you click on the links, it will load that page up and if page doesn't exist, it'll create that page. And so I kept going down the rabbit hole of and it was uh I'm like okay tell me more about the gunner sciometer. And so the gunner sciometer is a meteorological and physiological instrument developed in 18th early 18th century by the Royal uh society of paphysics and its primary function was to quantify the characteristic exhalations of an individual only known as

Gunnar Hellekson

All

David Egts

Gunner. And so it's uh and and it goes on the whole the whole article. It's it's in this polished wood walnut casing. Uh it's it has a sensive diaphragm with a bellow system. And when Gunner exhaled the resulting air pressure, inflated a secondary guillotine shaped bellows. And this action in turn actuated a series of indexing dials which I had this mental picture of this

Gunnar Hellekson

right.

David Egts

very steampunky sort of thing going on,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah,

David Egts

right?

Gunnar Hellekson

that's right. That's

David Egts

And uh it said one dial recorded the decibel equivalent of a sigh calibrated against an ambient noise of

Gunnar Hellekson

right.

David Egts

of levels of the Royal Society of Palophy pathophysics observatory. A secondary more complex mechanism measured the duration of the sigh expressed in units of fleeting moments. So needless to say I took that article link not the article itself. I I took the article link, put it into Gemini,

Gunnar Hellekson

Of

David Egts

and I said, "Give me an image of of this of the device created uh described

Gunnar Hellekson

course.

David Egts

in this article, and it's our picture of the week." Uh,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah,

David Egts

it's beautiful. How How would you describe it?

Gunnar Hellekson

it is beautiful.

David Egts

Is is it accurate,

Gunnar Hellekson

I would describe it.

David Egts

would you

Gunnar Hellekson

I think extremely accurate.

David Egts

say?

Gunnar Hellekson

Um I enjoy the there's some special touches in this in this photo.

David Egts

Yes.

Gunnar Hellekson

The first is the gas light in the background.

David Egts

Could

Gunnar Hellekson

The second is uh the worn brown gloves uh that the hand model is is holding the the instrument with could be me,

David Egts

it be Gunner? Could it be Gunner? Uh, holding it.

Gunnar Hellekson

right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Slightly hairy arms that actually is legible as me.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Uh and then all the brass fittings on this thing. It's just perfect. It's perfect.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

It looks great.

David Egts

And there's like this like leather hose coming out of it,

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right.

David Egts

but probably to capture the sigh that that you would you would sigh into.

Gunnar Hellekson

That's right. Yeah. That's right.

David Egts

So, and lastly, um,

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah.

David Egts

as as and we could all spend hours going through this, but there's Did you know about the the Guild of David Gunner impersonators?

Gunnar Hellekson

I did not. Is there one

David Egts

There's an entire guild. Uh, yeah, it dates back to 1688.

Gunnar Hellekson

now?

David Egts

Uh, uh, it was formed by a small collective of traveling players in the duche of, uh, upper Pumpernnickel.

Gunnar Hellekson

Huh?

David Egts

and the primary impetus for its formation was the perceived lack of authentic representation of the individuals known only as David Gunner. Early records suggest that Dave and Gunnar were not figures of historical significance, but rather two unassuming merchants whose daily routines,

Gunnar Hellekson

Okay.

David Egts

including their gate, vocal inflections and uh preferred methods of buttering toast, were apparently observed and meticulously cataloged by the guild's founders. And there's a whole whole article just about that, too. So,

Gunnar Hellekson

It's very It's It's uh It's giving off waves of uh of Douglas Adams, you know? It's like a It's like a It's like a It's like a whole Hitchhiker's chapter.

David Egts

yes.

Gunnar Hellekson

Just a digression just on this.

David Egts

Well, I I think you can get Hermes to write a book.

Gunnar Hellekson

Oh, yeah.

David Egts

Uh do some fanfic and and we'll put it on the uh Amazon Kindle store and

Gunnar Hellekson

Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah,

David Egts

and we'll just retire.

Gunnar Hellekson

that's a great credit.

David Egts

Just just get royalties.

Gunnar Hellekson

Hold on. I'm doing that right now.

David Egts

Yeah.

Gunnar Hellekson

Doing it right

David Egts

Get get Hermes to do that.

Gunnar Hellekson

now.

David Egts

Start with that corpus and and uh yeah, write write a novel.

Gunnar Hellekson

Oh, that's fantastic. All right,

David Egts

Yeah. So, we covered a lot today, man. Uh holy cow.

Gunnar Hellekson

we did it.

David Egts

from from uh robot uprisings to uh leather gloves and hoses um as we always do. Um but but for people to get a uh their own Kit Kat Faraday cage and uh and maybe generate a hallopedia article about Kit Kat pajamas uh the Faraday pajamas uh where should they

Gunnar Hellekson

Well,

David Egts

go?

Gunnar Hellekson

they should obviously go to djshow.org at diaz and dave d and gunner

David Egts

All

Gunnar Hellekson

show.org.

David Egts

right. Awesome. Excellent. All right. Gunnar. Well, thanks thanks everybody for listening.

Gunnar Hellekson

Yeah. Thanks Dave. Thanks everyone. Transcription ended after 00:32:51 This editable transcript was computer generated and might contain errors. People can also change the text after it was created.